Seemingly Impossible Number Of People In The Room Puzzle



Thanks to Dieter from Germany for the suggestion! This puzzle appeared in a German newspaper.

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38 thoughts on “Seemingly Impossible Number Of People In The Room Puzzle”

  1. Antes de entrar Ann en la sala, la edad media es (m=s/p); siendo “p” el número de personas presentes y “s” la suma de sus edades →→ Si “a” es la edad de Anne → (pm+a)/(p+1)=(m+4) → a=m+4(p+1) →→ (pm+2a)/(p+2)=(m+7) → a=m+(7/2)(p+2) →→→ m+4(p+1) = m+(7/2)(p+2) → p=6

    Gracias y un saludo cordial.

    Reply
  2. here's another method I used that seems a little easier:
    A = m + 4(n+1)
    the age of ann will be the initial average, plus 4 years for everyone now in the room, so that the average age gets raised by 4 years

    A = (m+4) + 3(n+2)
    the age of beth will be the new average (the initial average plus four years), plus 3 years for everyone now in the room

    A = A
    m + 4(n+1) = (m+4) + 3(n+2)
    4n + 4 = 4 + 3n + 6
    n = 10 – 4 = 6!!

    Reply
  3. i got a easier solution learnt from Singapore education.
    Let x be the number of people originally.

    Equating Ann excess to Beth excess from original average ,
    4(x + 1) = 3(x + 2) + 4
    Solving, we get x = 6

    Reply
  4. Wouldn't call this impossible, totally straightforward solution.
    t … total age initially
    n … number of people initially
    a … age of Anne and her twin respectively
    (t + a)/(n + 1) = t/n + 4
    (t + 2a)/(n + 2) = (t + a)/(n + 1) + 3 = t/n + 7

    remove fractions:
    0 = (t + 4n)(n + 1) – (t + a)n = 4n² + (4 – a)n + t
    0 = (t + 7n)(n + 2) – (t + 2a)n = 7n² + (14 – 2a)n + 2t

    combine:
    0 = 2•0 – 0 = n² – 6n = n(n – 6).

    If n = 0, average doesn't change, so must n = 6.

    Reply
  5. There are n people in the room.
    To raise the average age by 4, Ann has to be 4(n+1) years older than the original average.
    To raise the average age by 3, Beth has to be 3(n+2) years older than the average with Ann there – in other words, Beth is 3(n+2)+4 years older than the original average.
    Since Ann and Beth are twins, 4(n+1)=3(n+2)+4…. giving n=6
    In addition, we can generalise:
    Suppose Ann raises the average by x, and Beth raises the average by y:
    The equation becomes x(n+1)=y(n+2)+x…. giving n=2y/(x-y)
    (Obviously this will only make sense if (x-y) is a factor of 2y, so that there are a whole number of people!)

    Reply
  6. If Ann enters the room shortly before midnight/her birthday and her twin enters shortly after midnight, then there have been 5 people in the room originally. Is my math correct? ^^

    Reply
  7. Well I did some calculation starting with
    S/n + 4 = (S + A)/(n+1) and
    S/n + 7 = (S + 2A)/(n+2)
    I Eliminated S and got a single equation, where A eliminated itself and I got, that there have to be n = 22/7 people. oO

    Reply
  8. Ann’s age = Beth’s age = a

    Average age of people initially in room = n

    Number of people initially in room = x

    nx + a = (n + 4)(x + 1) → a = n + 4x + 4

    nx + 2a = (n + 7)(x + 2) → 2a = 2n + 7x + 14

    2n + 7x + 14 = 2(n + 4x + 4) = 2n + 8x + 8 → 6 = x

    There were 6 people in the room before Ann entered.

    Reply
  9. Ya: Ann's age, Y0: average age of the people before Ann entered room, n:number of people before Ann entered room. Then we have;
    Ya-Y0=4(n+1)
    2(Ya-Y0)=7(n+2)
    Or 8(n+1)=7(n+2)
    i.e. n=6, and Ya-Y0=28. So there were 6 people before Ann entered the room, and she is 28 years older than them on average. 😊

    Reply
  10. I did it reasoning that Ann must be (n+1)x4 years older than the average person in order to increase the average age by 4 and Beth must be (n+2)x3 years older than the average which now included Ann's age.

    Since all that matters is how much older the sisters are, you can think of everyone else in the room as being 0yrs old.

    So a 28yr old enters a room of six 0yr olds the avg age is 28/7=4yrs
    Another 28yr old enters and the avg age is 56/8=7yrs

    Reply
  11. I have written the age of Ann (A),: respectively the age of her twin sister (T) based on how they modify the value x for the average age of the n people present in the meeting room.
    (n1+n2+…+n)/n=x
    In other words, if we redistribute equally the total number of years to the n people, each of them gets a "share" of x years.

    (n1+n2+…+n+A)/(n+1)=x+4
    A must add to the initial sum of ages , a number of years encompassing x and (n+1) times the increase of 4 years to x:
    A=x+4(n+1)

    The average age after adding T looks like this:
    (n1+n2+…+n+A+T)/(n+1+1)=x+4+3
    Therefore T must enclose the "share"of (x+4) plus (n+2) times the increase of 3 years:
    T=x+4+3(n+2)=x+4+3n+6=x+3n+10

    Ann and her sister are twins, therefore:
    A=T
    x+4n+4=x+3n+10
    n=6
    "And that is the answer!" 😀
    Thank you for this crunchy riddle! ☘️

    Reply
  12. It's 6

    I think defining this "impossible' is an overkill.
    An algebraic solution is simple and staiightforward.

    Let X be a the number of people , Y is the sum of their ages and S the average age (before Ann's joining). Let's Z be Ann's age.
    So, we have following 3 equations.

    (1)  Y/X = S  so Y = SX
    (2)  (Y+Z)/(X+1) = S+4 so Y+Z = SX + 4X + 1S + 4
    (3)  (Y+2Z)/(X+2) = S+7 so Y + 2Z = SX + 7X + 2S + 14
    Subtract 1 from 2 and 2 from 3

    (2)-(1) Z = 4X + 1S + 4
    (3) -(2) Z = 3X + 1S + 10

    So that 4X + 4 = 3X + 10 hence X = 6

    Notice that the general case where first age increase  is M and second age increase is N resulted in
    Z = MX +1S + M
    Z = NX + 1S + M + 2N
    Hence
    X = 2N/(M-N)
    so in our case it's 2*3/(4-3),

    Reply
  13. I got 6 with a slightly different method.

    Let be:

    E the age of Ann and Beth

    M the average age of the original group

    N their number.

    Adding Ann to the group rises the average age by 4, so:

    E = M + 4(N+1)

    Because the age of Ann must be enough to rise by 4 the average age M of the N people plus herself

    Adding Beth rises the age by 3, so:

    E= (M+4) + 3(N+2)

    Because, for the same reason, the age of Beth (that's still E) adds 3 to the new average age (that is N+4) of all the N original people, plus Ann, plus herself.

    So:

    E = M + 4N + 4

    E = M + 4 + 3N + 6

    E = (M +4) + 4N

    E = (M + 4) + 3N + 6

    (M +4) + 4N = (M + 4) + 3N + 6

    4N = 3N + 6

    N = 6

    Reply
  14. Some observation: there are 2 equations, but 3 variables. Because nm cancels out constantly, instead of ending up with 3 sets of related 2-variable relations, the exercise ends on 1 solved variable and 2 related variables. n is 6 and for the others (not mentioned in the video) – twin's age is equal to average age + 28 (e.g. twins are 38 and there are 6x 10 yo).

    Reply
  15. The issue with trying to solve this from the thumbnail… the detail that it's a "meeting" and "a few people give Ann the evil eye" suggests that the others in the room are not newborn babies, something I hadn't factored in when trying to solve it.😂

    Reply
  16. Let T0 be total age, number be N.
    A = T0 / N. => T0 = A.N
    Enter Ann (x).
    T1 = T0 + x = (A+4) * (N+1)
    => AN+x=AN + A + 4N + 4
    => x = A + 4N + 4 ===A
    Enter twin
    T2 = T1 + x = (A+7).(N+2)
    => AN + 2x = AN + 2A + 7N + 14
    => 2x = 2A + 7N + 14 ===B
    Solve eqs A and B for N.
    and you'll get N = 6.

    Reply

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