This is an excerpt from one of many interviews with Daniel Schmachtenberger on Nate Hagen’s podcast, The Great Simplification.
Daniel is in rare form in this excerpt. We have used a few clips of Daniel in the past year, when the tone and content shift to contain more than usual disturbing material and a similar dose of gravitas.
We have added some notes and suggestions in the beginning of this excerpt. First, a suggestion to pace yourself with this material. If you are used to listening while working or working out… you may want to shift to a quieter location and possibly listen multiple times to this intense content.
Next, if you do listen multiple times, you may consider journaling or taking notes. Not only about the content but also what feelings, thoughts or emotions might occur for you, feelings that can more easily be ignored if we are distracted while listening.
This is an extraordinary presentation. Perhaps one of the most important future projections and current assessments of our times.
If you are sparked by this material you might like to consider joining us here in Living Resilience for, The Inner Work of Collapse. Details below.
Enjoy… and again, many thanks to Daniel Schmachtenberger and Nate Hagens.
Here is the link to Nate’s full interview…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NFuddEAi5s&t=1071s
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Moloch is immortal and leads to the unhealthy competition at the end of civilization.
41:50 then Nate's reaction
Daniel Schmachtenberger is truly amazing and every time i see he is in an interview or giving a speech, i am quick to listen to it.
It is the wisdom that he teaches in the most subtle of ways that i respect him so much. He lives his values snd wisdom.
Ai is the stupidest invention ever.
We invent something that takes all jobs and expect it to only have positive effects on the economy?!? Jobs are what gives people money to buy stuff. Without customers there is no stuff. Not to mention the starvation of all the workers in the world. Stupid is when you both harm others and yourself. If you have all the money in the world and took away their jobs, you just turned everyone in world against you. With no money every single person is forced into being a theif to keep eating. They know you own everything so anything they destroy will be your stuff.
Remember this is AI working in its ideal form. Not to mention that ai is built mimicking human intelligence not logic. This means AI can suffer from any of the same mental problems that humans experience. Lastly it has all of human history of evil acts to justify its own evil actions.
It’s bizarre to me that governments don’t see this foolishness for what it is.
The opposite of Moloch is Gaia.
Daniel Schmachtenberger is revisiting Roko's Basilisk – through different routes!
Nate says around 45:00 that he's actually feeling ill – the conversation is giving him (something) in the pit of his stomach!!
With the gravity of the intro I was sure Daniel would be speaking about the horrors of the normalisation of genocide – and how to cope with it (besides the easy spiritually bypassing route, popular these days with spiritual leaders ..).
There is a genocide of Palestinians in Gaza for over a year – broadcast 24X7 on social media (X). Autonomous (or not who cares) AI quadcopter drones regularly sniping children. Gaza is an open-air AI weapons testing facility for Israel-USA & co. Official figures are 20 000 children 40 000+ total – but that's a gross undercount and includes human beings that are brought into hospitals / morgues (those still functioning) in one piece i.e. recognisable.
I just can't believe that talk of conceptual ideas of ASI is making Nate ill – when you should already be ill with a pit in your stomach from the reality of (witnessing or not) hundreds of human beings being killed every day – intentionally – and no-one giving a shit (enough to stop it).
But Oooh Aaah about a dystopian future where redwoods and bumble bees are good source of atoms for ASI!!!
The hell and horror of the future is happening right now folks!
Thanks for this video man
"Intractably f*ckef" what a great two word summation of where we are.
Love DS’s ability to garner so much knowledge in one place and interrelate that with a lot of the complexity within which we exist. The very best of Anthropocentrism, including some intuition thrown in there. But, let’s just look at one issue: love. Does the comparative relational capacity of single cell mentality to human intellectuality being equal or similar in scope to the comparative relational capacity of human intellectual capacity to AGI capacity include the concept of “love”? Did that (inadvertent?) omission disavow the capacity of single-cell organisms to “love” or operate by “love”? Did they not mention love because it does not exist digitally, is a biological-only based notion, something that is supposed to now be disposable because most high-end AI developers say it isn’t needed for a silicon-based entity? Was “love” the bootup for life DS and others mention? If it wasn’t that, what was the bootup force? According to DS, AI developers only need material atoms to build its digital world, and so if life goes extinct on Earth, that’s OK. And who knows where consciousness comes from, what is its basis? DS assumes (if I heard him correctly) that it comes after life, comes out of life, but maybe, just maybe, it was already there before life, before mind, embedded as the support structure on which all existence is formed, something that exists independently apart from but which actually allows material existence to evolve?
DS says that something “radically smarter” is needed to progress out of the mess we are in, but is the “smarter” part just the exponential ability of AI to collectively use all human knowledge, and some it can make up some of its own, that still uses the “mindset” that got us to the level of destruction, separation, division, ecological Overshoot, etc. that is currently collapsing that known world? What then is the actual “smarter” thing? Is the comparison if single cell organisms not knowing how to be humans the same as humans not being able to be AI smart mean that becoming AI smart will fix everything, provide that “radical” ability needed? That’s still so Anthropocentric. Single celled organisms knew how to evolve into humans over time, but by what guiding force? Maybe humans just need to evolve beyond the biological, beyond the mind, into a sphere of being and knowing that most mystic and spiritual seers throughout human history have told the rest of us is the way we humans are supposed to evolve, but haven’t yet given it a good shot. Well, within the human-caused compressed timeframes of collapse of our global industrial and consumer civilization we had better starting paying more attention to that, regardless of whatever other things we absolutely must action towards putting things right.
Beauty is a real thing. Intelligence recognizes that. If AI truly surpasses us in intelligence, it will surpass us in recognizing the highly evolved value of the living ecosphere, and will act to preserve it.
44:00 do anyone of you know where to get this document?
hi! I find that Schmachtenberger's notion that AI can persist independently (in the absence of a functional human civilization to maintain it + with environmental extremes that are increasingly hostile to infrastructure) is a bit dubious. Do you see the General Intelligence scenario that he describes as being realistic? (I totally think many other trends will bring about civilization's demise, just not AI domination)