Warning! Extreme Spoilers Ahead.
This is the first of a new series where two Lore Masters sit down and ask the deep questions only Lore Masters have questioned. Answers is another thing. But questions, well, in this one we wonder whether The Primarchs were ever meant to be born?
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Quipster must've attended drama or acting classes because his dramatic intro was a masterclass
@Quipster @Winters what are your thoughts on the lost primarchs?
stephen hawking level genius, yet the audio for them, in games, and books, all has them as ranting imbeciles.
space marine lore is fkd
All the confusion and possibilities, strange mortals with curious customs, you’re merely Tzeentch’s puppets.
I’m shocked to say I disagree with Winters. I agree with Quipster. I believe the primarch project was always meant to be his inner circle / high council. With the Astartes as his world governors/ leaders. Winters is clinging onto this theory of ‘jelly in a test tube’ by reading too much into the initial analysis of Alpharius. To me that was just alpharius’ POV showing how intelligent/ omnipotent and calculating this being in front of him (emps) was. That he could analyse like that, as a scientist, at a first glance.
So deep you need diving goggles.
I think Winters glasses is what sold this video lol
i assume thats water quipster is drinking but it looks like vodka. if im ever in the UK ill accept that coffee you offered me a few years ago though
I do agree with Quipster's favourable opinion of the Emperor. Leutin has been slightly annoying me in that i think he goes too far in his condemnation of Big E. It reminds me of the Star Wars fandom in their reaction to the Jedi not seeing through Palpatine, the Jedi's mistaken belief in Anakin, etc, in that in both cases, the heroes aren't perfect & are trying to do what they can in bad circumstances. Although, it could be argued that Big E has done a better job than the Jedi Council.
This was absolutely the best thing I've seen in a very long time, I really hope this keeps happening.
I have a question I'm not terribly knowledgeable in the lore but does it feel like the chaos gods are becoming something that contradicts their core foundations in fighting humanity the way they are doing so?
I can only see Quipster in Custodes Gold.
Phenomenal conversation between you two Loremasters. I completely agree that Luetin is the GOAT when it comes to lore, but listening to a conversation seems so much more engaging than an audio essay (not to take anything away from his format at all). Really enjoyed this, hope you guys find the time to keep on having these chats.
This was excellent! I kept going to agree or disagree and then realised we weren't actually down the pub. More please!
You should make this a regular weekly/2 weekly thing! Really enjoyed this debate
What if his plan was to have 20 Marines on every world to run his Imperium? A council on each world to counter every problem .
Looking forward to more lore talks like this!
Imagine you conquer the Galaxy, then you need an immense force to defend it from external threats, plus galaxies are not endless: they get destroyed by crushing into other galaxies. You need to prepare to conquer othe galaxies or you will not be perpetual for long…
So possibly you need even more Space Marines than the ones available pre-Heresy.
Also Primarchs are ment to keep the geneseed unaltered. The genes get modified by cosmic rays and just by living.
Yeeeessssss… This is the content we love!
Now y'all need to get 40k Theories and Oculus Imperia and we'll be cooking with gas! 🔥
I think there would never be a time where the astartes would not be needed. Even once the galaxy had been conquered, there could be threats from outside the galaxy.
Otherwise the legions could indeed become the planetary lords.
If the primarchs were not needed to fulfil a specific function in peacetime, they could serve in a high lords of terra capacity, running the imperium as brothers, serving the emperors will, ruling over their legions as they in turn rule over their worlds.
Seems to fit well enough to me
I think Winters' own point at 1:14:18 about the warpcraft illustrates why the primarchs may have been supposed to leave their pods: taking their genes to create the legions doesn't seem like it makes use of the warpcraft inherent to them. There is something more the emperor needed from the legions, that the primarch is some way provide, that necessitated the warpcraft to begin with.
unrelated: the cynic in me makes a good case that the emperor is currently trying to ascend as a chaos god, though I don't think this was always the (primary) plan.
How can you be macador when you talk about outcast dead as if it is real or good lore?
Winters I love ya but I got to disagree 1. The primarchs are not perpetuals they are just functionally immortal perpetuals can resurrect from death Vulkan was the only actual perpetual. 2. The space marines were meant to stay out of the web way but still be outside in the actual galaxy to protect the entrances to the web way. So when Corax said the utopia wasn't for them he meant they weren't going into the webway with the rest of humanity they were staying the wider galaxy to fight and protect.
Really good, definitely do more 👍🏻
Great content – Would love to hear more
And what beautiful custodes you have too !!!
I always thought that the Astartes can adapted/ change during peace time. Also there might always be another galaxy to conquer.
I like the idea which you said about the Emperor realising he can’t win now so as long as he doesn’t lose. I was thinking maybe his new method to win now is to sit on the golden throne, be worshiped and become a god and kill the chaos gods himself. What do you think of that idea?
Why can I only like this once? This is the best video. More please!
We have to know what warp spices were added to the Primarchs before we answer this question.
Given the connection Marines show to their primarch, is it possible they would have had the same effect on their legions if they had never left their gestation tanks?
Would the primarchs have served just as well if they were always entombed like the Emperor is now?
The problem of using the "emperor of mankind" is its a weird book that screws with the lore and much as tries to explain it.
Primarchs: They had roles and purpose in the eye of emperor because they were made from his genes. the issue that most of primarchs books have to many writers or they didn't respect cannon before either. They were "tools" and would eventually outlive their usefulness
Lost primarchs-intentional GW mystery or something went "wrong", one theory is one is sigmar from the old world, because kaldor "talks about traveling to the "world that was". they were captured and put in the dungeons basically.
Emperor- a man of great mystery and then lore is all over the place because you have pre-emperor of man kind then post-emperor of mankind periods. If he has foresight he could kinda protect or create his plans, because he either saw the HH coming or it just happened. His hatred of depriving the chaos of fuel with souls/power and why would want to be new chaos god or aka "starchild" in 40k
What do you do with 20mill marines? Whatever you want! 😅
But also…
Tyranids… Great crusade era they weren't a thing. Now they are.
Necrons… Great crusade era they weren't a thing. Now they are.
The galaxy is is large, nevermind the universe, and there are always threats. 20 perpetuals of unmatched (almost…) poer and potential, backed up by a few million hard bitten genius scholar warrior monks, is not a bad insurance policy against those uncertainties.
No1 talked about the dark elder,
what would space marines or a primearch do with freedom,being bored from mastering stuff and having all the time?
the elder went crazy,
the space marines controlling a planet stops them from being bored,
plus they need vacations.
problem I just thought of=what happens when they choose their own life instead of the emporor and do what they want?
This is awesome. Absolute entertainment.
Excellent duo, love this and hope to see more!
I need more of these discussions in my life , awesome show guys keep up the good work👍👍
Quipster seems like a lovely bloke but my god he's the king of the tories 😂
Love this winters!!!
Been waiting for this !
I think everyone kind of misses the point about Alpharius. He’s not just CIA he’s the Emperor’s inside man. Loyal to the idea of the Imperium no matter who leads.