#Warhammer40k #40knews
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As a Space Marine player the new player argument is kinda furstrating? Is GW only using win% into consideration for the balance slates? If you want to weed out the new players from the statistic why not also look at # of top tournament placements (depending on size of the the tourny of course). While not perfect, top placements in a tournament can add more insight on the possible strength of a codex if played optimally.
As a Necron player, the "nerfs" were more like a slap on the wrist.
Should we still expect a points change to go along side this soon?
Is that a joke that you think everything is balanced? This is crap.
That was a waste of everyone’s time yet again GW. Another epic fail from them again after such a big apology from the LoV codex, i thought they would have picked up their game. SM is their best selling faction, so I seriously do not understand their logic of doing next to nothing. just give us a 10-15% points cut across key units esp troops. Buff the bolters, chainswords and +1A base for eveyone and see how it goes. Pretty simple fix and they still did nothing . 🤷🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
Love your videos! I like the sight changes as opposed to the knee jerk over fixes we’ve seen in the past. Marines did need more, especially the low performing ones. Also- what about gsc? It’s like GW just forgot about them
For admech, this doesn't change much… like for example half of the codex isn't even viable and The cp changes to admech has hurt it alot and these changes do nothing to really help it. i see its winrate to be 40% maximum
It is only the Necron Characters that are vehicles that lose the core keywords. Which is just the Command Barge and Silent King.
Why didn't Flamers go up though I'm not complaining aha
The reason everyone is so disappointed with this is because of the time taken and with all their resources we got 5 dot points. I could've come up with a similar result in my lunch break at work
Light touch on Space Marines is an understatement. Guess they hope to fix them with points.
The wording on the leviathan change means NO synapse units that or not [MONSTERS] will not receive the 1-2
So no Warriors, Primes, Neuros, Zoans, even the Parasite
Huge mess up and personally another stupid oversight by GW
It's not enough. If they're adjusting printed material they need to address secondaries as it's part of the mix.
It's not just about points and army rules but how the armies score the points to win the match.
Armies at the top like sister and necron have very easy secondaries. It's part of the mix, and shouldn't be ignored in the balance.
Buffing Space Marines will never do much to improve their win rates and if it does, then to the detriment of the game as a whole.
The issue with Space Marines has never been the codices, but always the players.
What makes a good tournament player is the ability to accept casualties, trade effectively and stick to the plan.
What makes a bad tournament player is being one of those guys with pet units he can't stand losing, who gets angry or sad when his beloved Death Star gets decimated or tied up.
Thanks to its character with all the armor and re-rolling Morale Checks and all that stuff, Space Marines are a faction that appeals to and attracts the latter kind of player, people who can't stomach playing a fragile army. Those guys will always suck at tournaments, no matter how good the codices are they are getting and they will always drag down the win rates for Space Marines.
I'm happy I can put my admech on the shelf for another quarter year and play 30k.
I love how no one cares that most armies have but one usable sub faction, but it’s Space Marines the worlds over. 🤣😂
These changes won't affect 90% of games at all and the other 10% is very minor. This dataslate is actually insulting after the rape they did to LoV.
They actually took the slow and steady route. Color me surprised.
Totally agree with tyranids change. Not sure how I feel about necrons changes. Necrons' whole thing is resurrecting things. Cutting a lot out of that feels weird. There were def worse things they could have addressed instead. Also hugely disappointed by the space marine changes.
BUT, because they took the slow and steady route none of that ruins anything. The real risk now with every dataslate is that they ruin our current unprecedented diversity
As a Tyranid main, I'm relatively happy with the leviathan change, means people will be more likely to use other fleets and also can avoid units getting overpriced due to leviathan bossing the other fleets. More fun for opponent to play against as well. On another note I think they should do away with transhuman altogether and just replace it with FNP, just my opinion
Wait. They explicitly called out menhir respons but the change they did doesn't effect that.
Menhirs don't have the character keyword
Yeah thats not a light touch on space marines, thats a no touch. Literally useless.
Does it give back my options for Chaos Lords? Then no it hasn't gone far enough!
Space Marine armies underperform for unexpected reasons… Maybe because their Codex has become a sword at a gunfight? It feels a little bit that the Codex is from a different edition of the game. I don`t understand why they make 2 other saves one regular and one called "invulnerable save" but then everybody gets rules to ignore them. What`s even the point of them if everybody suddenly gets rules to ignore them? But then even better Tyranids come along and suddenly they can deal 30-40 MWs per turn. WTF!?! Does the game work like this now? What happened to my safe throw and the basic key mechanics of the game??? But it gets even worse because here are the squats and their whole army doesn`t even have to wound but still trigger all the 6s to wound effects. WTF?!? TBH to me as a Space Marine player, it feels like they are cheating. I thought the game worked like you have to hit, to wound and your opponent gets a save and important characters have a 4+ invul because they are important and because it makes great dramatic duels. But then everybody gets rules to bend around this. Some just have to hit others you can`t even save against or they just ignore your invuls. I mean sure, give me a new update where plasma fire deals MWs and Suppressors get splash damage also Powerswords can ignore Invuls now and Space Marines would be doing much better.
I am such a new player and I did okay but it feels to me right now that Space Marines are the army for new players where you learn how to play the game but if you really want to play Warhammer 40k then you better don`t play Space Marines because your enemies will just ignore several parts of the rules in the name of GW.
well needless to say this is super disappointing as a space marine player
As a Black Templar player, my feelings on these changes or lack thereof are entirely dependent on the Minutorum. I'd be fine if SM just gets some nice points cuts.
i play levi because im to bad for kraken and i find it hilarious that this dataslate did not hit my list like at all. Yes have to be more carefull with tyrant now… but thats it. The only units that no longer get trans are my 2 units of 3 warriors who hold my backline and my neurothrope… who is uninteractable for the entire match
Silly changes. Tyranids have woeful troops choices and leviathan had an option for some very durable troops which are now gone they should have addressed balance in other ways which leaves flavour of factions in tact. A 4+ save with 3w in the current meta will simply melt away. Less durable than a space marine now, for more points. As I've said before troops aren't the issue, the issue is that space marine special units in general suck. Tyranid special units are a bit over tuned. No changes to the Harpy ? But they bump down warriors. While they're pumping up the damage of other factions massively, GW have no idea about balance.
Man so disappointed in this balance sheet….nothing to help marines but a slightly easier to score secondary…..yeah cool gw but my troops are still insanely overpriced and my 8th edition rules and abysmal strats aren’t keeping me in the fight even slightly and lets not get started on the “new player” BS 🙄.
Guess my group will stick to the 20% point discount to balance my faction out until gw give us an actual 9th edition update that makes our troops worth their points and keeps up with everyone else.
Bro, i just need points reductions on my SM. I dont have enough attacks that are strong enough with my entire army. High wound, high T models are impossible to kill for 70% of my army. Nor do i have enough activations with 2 squads to clear chaff. Its just depressing. Ran into a chaos demon army and my final score was…11. Its nuckin ruff bro
This isn't even a touch, this is a literal "go fuck yourself" by gw.
WE're suffering out here, and the best they got is hit on a terrible secondary into a insulting terrible secondary
No sisters nerfs either. 200 point Celestein is bullshit
I don't think shock tactics is that bad anymore for an extremely aggressive army, it's not really for me because I play more defensively but I can see how an offensive army would be able to repeatedly steal objectives from an army like mine, a large part of my strategy is based around mitigating that, and stopping the opponent from taking me off objectives or grabbing them after those models have been killed. odds are if you're at a really aggressive army that focused it's force on one flank, you'd be able to take one objective off of me I'd say about three turns of the game, that would leave you with 12 points which isn't bad. Maxing it would be difficult because that would mean you'd need to take me off objectives turn two when I'm best dug in. But that's also a very defensive army like I said, I imagine it would be even easier against another aggressive army, the hardest part being not giving up those points in return, definitely a bad pick against hoardes.
What is so frustrating to me is that GW literally markets space marines as totally different armies that each have different strategies to handle warfare. That’s LITERALLY the way they wrote space marines in lore. Raven Guard do not approach war (in lore AND IN GAME) in the same way that iron hands does. They. Are. Different. Factions. They also have… LITERALLY DIFFERENT BOOKS THAT YOU NEED TO BUY. If you’re going to expect me to buy the book for the faction. Then I’m going to expect GW to update my book. My faction specific Raven guard book. That they decided to create, and that they deliberately did not include in the new 9th edition codex.
This was super Polly Annie all over geedub’s jock… barfed in my mouf
Tbh the changes to the space marine secondary is useless to the weakest space marine factions. Imperial/ crimson fist, raven guard, ultramarines, and deathwatch are more shooty based marines that don’t want to over extend there units and lose them in melees they have no chance of winning or trading efficiently in. As a fist player I can’t imagine trying to fling a unit into the teeth of my enemy holding an objective in the mid board and expect them to survive let alone kill some of these more tanky units in the game. Shock tactics is for assault army’s that gain most of there strength by getting close or charging into melee to do damage. We desperately need range weapon buffs that we can build around or access to some sort of cheaper melee damage.
they need to balance before they print core. rule books and codexes!
I'd like to see irrelevant units get big buffs, mix up the meta, sell more models, win win win for everyone. I'm looking at you monoliths, wardens, infiltrators, etc.
They should have made bolter weapons ignore all attack modifiers (+/- hit, wound, damage)
Space marines need a boost to there basic wepons to make them do more and some other wepon boost
Great commentary , thanks
SM players always amuse me as much as they frustrate me. SM just aren't a GOTCHA faction and that's their only problem that I can see. They are sooooo powerful independently and can be buffed ON TOP of that. And that seems very lore consistent to me. SM players easily dominate casual players of non-SM factions because of this. When you look at the top players, they have refined their armies to such a degree and have such an indepth knowledge of every meta they'll encounter that they can squeeze every last drop out of every stratagem and every interaction. SM players don't have the same resources of stratagems,, in my personal experience, and rely much more heavily on their base abilities and doctrines. Which are ridiculous, by the by, in any casual game. SM are just not tuned for competitive play by their very nature of being a beginner army.
I feel as if they should have Made abbadon more expensive
There are far, far too many experienced players who can't win with Space Marines. The argument that the performance of Space Marines is due to new players throwing off the stats isn't accurate.
Changing one Nephilim Secondary really doesn't come close to addressing the flaws of the faction.
SM needs an overhaul.
I don’t know why I never see this mentioned, but the 8th to 9th nerfs need to be undone.
Furthermore all the mini marines need to be buffed up to par with CSM, so their vehicles are relevant again and their infantry aren’t overcosted anymore.
GW are being massive cowards on this faction, pretending that our old models are still part of the game, but deliberately keeping them useless. It’s frustrating, especially because it’s so blatantly cynical.
Finally on SM it’s rarely mentioned, but one of their handicaps is that everyone is familiar with all of their models and rules.
The idea that new players skew the data so they’re not representative is a bad excuse. They know full well that SM are at the bottom because most of the faction is neutered from the nerfs done to appease complainers.
This comes from the perspective of someone who does not play SM besides GK (and because they have so much unique stuff I consider them to be more a part of the Inquisition than SM), I don't understand GW's nonsensical thinking with regard to the SM faction. They want people to buy SM and make all these different sub factions that are all supposed to play differently to show the different ways their primarch's approached war……. But when it comes to updating the rules for all these factions GW time and time again just decides to update them as a giant blob and just give them all the same shit…… So then then why even have sub factions in SM at all if they knew they couldn't be bothered to do the work to keep them unique?
It's so frustrating that there was no changes for 8th edition Guard. They said the codex was right around the corner, codex drops. Then they say you can't use it until full release.