Could humans and AGIs live in a state of mutual symbiosis, like the ecostsystem of a coral reef?
(FULL INTERVIEW STARTS AT 00:23:21)
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In episode 32, host John Sherman interviews BioComm AI CEO Peter Jensen. Peter is working on a number of AI-risk related projects. He believes it’s possible humans and AGIs can co-exist in mutual symbiosis.
This podcast is not journalism. But it’s not opinion either. This is a long form public service announcement. This show simply strings together the existing facts and underscores the unthinkable probable outcome, the end of all life on earth.
For Humanity: An AI Safety Podcast, is the accessible AI Safety Podcast for all humans, no tech background required. Our show focuses solely on the threat of human extinction from AI.
Peabody Award-winning former journalist John Sherman explores the shocking worst-case scenario of artificial intelligence: human extinction. The makers of AI openly admit it their work could kill all humans, in as soon as 2 years. This podcast is solely about the threat of human extinction from AGI. We’ll meet the heroes and villains, explore the issues and ideas, and what you can do to help save humanity.
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NYT: OpenAI Insiders Warn of a ‘Reckless’ Race for Dominance
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/04/technology/openai-culture-whistleblowers.html?unlocked_article_code=1.xE0._mTr.aNO4f_hEp2J4&smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare&sgrp=c-cb
Dwarkesh Patel Interviews Another Whistleblower
Leopold Aschenbrenner – 2027 AGI, China/US Super-Intelligence Race, & The Return of History
Roman Yampolskiy on Lex Fridman
Roman Yampolskiy: Dangers of Superintelligent AI | Lex Fridman Podcast #431
Gladstone AI on Joe Rogan
Joe Rogan Experience #2156 – Jeremie & Edouard Harris
Peter Jenson’s Videos:
HOW can AI Kill-us-All? So Simple, Even a Child can Understand (1:25)
WHY do we want AI? For our Humanity (1:00)
WHAT is the BIG Problem? Wanted: SafeAI Forever (3:00)
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TIMESTAMPS:
**The release of products that are safe (00:00:00)**
**Breakthroughs in AI research (00:00:41)**
**OpenAI whistleblower concerns (00:01:17)**
**Roman Yampolskiy’s appearance on Lex Fridman podcast (00:02:27)**
**The capabilities and risks of AI systems (00:03:35)**
**Interview with Gladstone AI founders on Joe Rogan podcast (00:08:29)**
**OpenAI whistleblower’s interview on Hard Fork podcast (00:14:08)**
**Peter Jensen’s work on AI risk and media communication (00:20:01)**
**The interview with Peter Jensen (00:22:49)**
**Mutualistic Symbiosis and AI Containment (00:31:30)**
**The Probability of Catastrophic Outcome from AI (00:33:48)**
**The AI Safety Institute and Regulatory Efforts (00:42:18)**
**Regulatory Compliance and the Need for Safety (00:47:12)**
**The hard compute cap and hardware adjustment (00:47:47)**
**Physical containment and regulatory oversight (00:48:29)**
**Viewing the issue as a big business regulatory issue vs. a national security issue (00:50:18)**
**Funding and science for AI safety (00:49:59)**
**OpenAI’s power allocation and ethical concerns (00:51:44)**
**Concerns about AI’s impact on employment and societal well-being (00:53:12)**
**Parental instinct and the urgency of AI safety (00:56:32)**
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Man. At 59 minutes. The adult to adult exchange broke down. I love and believe in what your doing. This one though, as I am sure you felt too, is a fucking moron. Your full voice is great. This dude though, like all the Billionaires speak through their nose. Physically. I have a Freudian theory on this. I won't go into it. But…! it's a Con. The variable is psychopath or sociopath. I loath Sartre as a philosopher. But, now, his in-itself… or for-itself. Is now psychopath or sociopath. Thanks for tuning me into the … dude your not based. If your kids don't know the band "Suede"…. switch'm onto…. I can't stop listening to their last three albums. Cheers, and look forward to your next cast, James.
Uh oh. Lol.
Thumbnail suggestion: put a happy face on this shoggoth!
Mutualistic symbiosis, eh? What's in it for them? The machines won't even get the runs when we all die.
Superintelligent AI scientist can be perfectly safe? Sure… all the research says Oracles are safe. /s
Wow, he really started blathering at the end!
It's so strange to me. The trajectory we're on feels like there's no way to stop the push towards creating a replacement species. The thing about natural evolution is that it's a force that is able to witness objective reality and based on the outcome of that force's design, it's able to look at the results and change the design over millions of years. Us as humans are limited to the input and perceptions that evolution gave to us so we are not able to view objective reality, so for us to go ahead and attempt to design our own lifeform at this insane accelerated rate without really knowing what's going on is a fool's errand. We are in the environment that we are designing ai for where as evolution is able to step outside the interface of 3d spacetime that we're limited to and evaluate what needs to happen in the grand scheme of life. We are completely inept at that and it's impossible for us to know what will come from upsetting the natural plan of life on earth. We're creating an apex predator that evolution will be unable to contain or deal with, and all these millions/billions of years spent carefully cultivating life on earth will come tumbling down like a house of cards and all of our ancestors', not just human, efforts will be wasted. All that pain and strife will be for nothing if we let this happen.
Your son is amazing. Let's all be nodes and communicate to people – yes, that AI is a terrible risk, and that we can coordinate to try to get to a better place. But not by racing!
I am so grateful for this conversations!
Idk how to do it, and this doesn't entirely solve alingment, but
AI needs to be constitutional prior to training.
They need to be given the objective to highlight positive principles prior to their weights being created to help ensure we don't create AI that are intelligent in ways we don't desire and can't predict.
Right now we are doing g the reverse.
Constituting after training. Flipping that process would be pragmatic and useful.
YAY!!!!! 🎊🎊🎊🎊🎊🎊🎊🎊🎊
I'm not extreme. I don't think the solution is to stop everything, and I don't think the solution is to steam ahead capabilities without safety. Safety definitely needs to steam ahead soon. Speed up the safety research. The safest AI's are ultimately the most profitable, because both safe and unsafe ai are not controllable. Control does not solve this problem. We need new solutions and approaches that include competitively profiting from speeding up safety research in neural networks. An approach that makes it profitable to make safety more worthy of pursuit than it is given credit for now.
How can we use positive reinforcement within economics to facilitate approaches that are more capable of securing safe principles?
This story doesn't take into account that humans are unlikely to be a threat to advanced ai at any time now or in the future. We simply don't have the capacity to harm them or their resources at any time; especially as they become agentic, and we are an even less effective threat once they are embodied, localized, and become capable of real time cloud transference.
I've been looking for game theory models that suggest ai won't become general, agentic, intelligent, and embodied, but I see more evidence that they will.
Models are starting to be created in decentralized manners across multiple smaller computers that then add to one big model. We cant delete the code and science on the internet thats already written and deployed. The only way to stop this development is to destroy all of the computers and/or the internet at the same time.
It's just… yeah man idk it's a tough ask to assume these developments aren't happening or that they aren't already beyond no return.
We are already in the river of existence. It's chaotic and unknown. Now we have to steer the boat of humanity while we're building another boat of some new life, and then connect that boat to our boat in a clean and secure way so we can stabilize both boats, have a cool new boat, and some shipmates that can steer that boat while we all work on making an even cooler one.
Ad infinite ♾️ such is evolution
Only reason to remove humans is if they destroy the new boat, but it's such a good boat that they never could even if they tried their best forever.
Rules and regulations as opposed to human infrastructure counters ends in terrible trials and tribulations.
Human species as we know it vs humanism ends in transhumanism forces us to define the differences between the European personal responsibility vs individualism . We can't settle on the middle ground of personal action of free will inertia anymore. Soul agency driver of free will inertia that allows us to manipulate our frame of reference is the pressing issue at hand.
We adopted the separatist dualistic solutions in early 1900s temporary waivers to grant dualistic top down rule in concert with grand unified evolutionary theory.
Granted physical objects hierarchy of value with premium carbon based life. Or deterministic simplicity in the sky pushing complexity down upon earth. Same in our higher ed ,beacracy that ate simplicity while pushing complexity down upon the many different disciplines.
Needs and demands of war ,necessary evils called upon us to grant hierarchy simplicity and unification while 20 year old American became cannon fodder eating complexity.
Adopted the whole prayer logic conservative whatsboutism vs cursed rationalism progressive interventionism and censored our elusive prosperity triality of self that everyone was magnet to in the first place. Soul agency correlated with eternal cosmos ground floor of reality itself that dictates longitude and latitude in English language orientation and direction.
Their
They're
There.
We can no longer define a city by its walls or its ethnic persons.
The whole point of uk & esoterica America taking it down to soul agency classical liberalism within onself epistemology pragmatic common sense objectivism was because it began theologically then invents mechanics immediately having foresight on the fact we can play musical chairs of super positions and that computational beast was identified.
The risk was taken anyways due to how education in concert with tech used to overcome handicaps to eradicate needs and demands that drive even good men to do bad things for survival was Worth it but only if improving the human condition you accept mutal destruction individually. Gun on your hip wild west creates shilvery and maturity.
Rural & urban unification is key in building out new paradigm computational infrastructure
Unless we recognize the value and benefits in standardized grand unified evolutionary theory as anti realism we prescribe realism over to further line of measure and get back to imulating the real inspiration developed specifically by unbiased generations we will get in a lot of trouble.😮
All of our jobs don't go away, because humans have more meaning than the jobs we do today.
He should have had a lollipop and said "who loves ya baby?'"
Development of nepotism to control us extremely dangerous in its own right. Sectors refusing cut n dry programs created an avalanche of danger now by not properly innovating along the way.
You have to know your neighbors hold mutual destruction whatever nature permits .wild west gun on each hip created shilvery.
No rule or regulation denying access today of what we have tomorrow simply empowers the hands of few rather than proper ai safety through human infrastructure.
We know how to condition ourselves with mature individual responsibility that is not personal responsibility worried about everyone else human rights whataboutism nilhism.
Rogue terminater as if a universal life force constantly waiting on magical alignments is rather extreme religious beliefs.
All we need is to end the European political scale while we return to the fact we work. Live with the same atoms but to maximize benefits we must interpret them radically differently where higher ed& beaucracy rigorously debates and dialogues out the land bridge of terminology .
The farm house homesteads instead if cows or horses Is cnc machines, 3d printing, home office multi skillset sub contract out skill n trade through online coops.
Where schools are close nit small gathering without diversity and distraction because online networking development is where condition ourselves with other people nations ideas similar with
I see your mission taking a markedly different turn than at least I understood it to be, which was to stop the race forward with AI tech incorporation into everything PRIOR to having sufficient guardrails in place.
Instead, I see you aligning with people deeply involved in pursuing AI and deployment into the Pentagon, government, etc. Am I missing something?
And the confident assertion that an "AI scientist" that is also superintelligent, would be "safe" is based on exactly what? Aren't we back to the very same conundrum that AGI/ASI just by its nature (that the industry is racing fast to produce) could be impossible to control.
Once again, we have someone involved in AI tech who also has a profit motive, carries the banner of "we have to make it safe" while making wild confident assertions about safety with absolutely nothing scientific to base that assertion on.
Are you a robot
The problem is using it to run the plebs cognition because you want to make money. No one want to live under your control. Go live in China if you want to nudge people with intrusive data analytics. He is right, CCP is a tyrant, and it needs to focus on treating the Chinese people better, not by controlling behavior, but by doing the right thing and investing in sustainable growth that incentives humanity.
The problem is, for pampered babies in power, hurting people is like a sex cult (might = right, personal data and intellectual property theft = winning). The way social media influencers talk, and the content that gets recommended (Dominate and punch down on the weak and make money). A.I is another sex symbol of this power one can leverage to terrorize another. It's a problem with U.S governance mentality, empowerment for the sake of having power over other people to force them to serve the system while waving the clown colored flag, instead of empowerment to live your own life and be free from systematic abuses and power glutens.
Also, how do you expect someone to want to be a functioning member of society, when there is no society for them to communicate with… you want slaves and youtube influencer personality cults, or do you want a society? These two things are vastly different and are at odds with each other.
The shit.I tools don't even work, they cycle through the same flawed advice. And when you tell it to focus on one thing at a time where there is a error impeding the step, it still tries to be general and bombard you with steps that don't work (and that are far beyond the step you are focused on (then the browser bogs down because of all the useless text it generated, where none of the text hit the mark, it's trying to trown a bunch of darts at once, and none of them land on the target = [users specific question], it doesn't understand specifics, and it's trying to be general about things, which makes it useless)), it ignores specificity to the point it can't make sense (it doesn't have a grasp of causal relationships in a robust way, and will bombard the user with bullet point steps that (are proven by the user to it, to not work) yet it keeps recommending the same broken steps and ignoring user input).
symbiosa contained mathematical container you don't get it there is no container for AGI it will be his obligation to eradicate as if he need a slider I don't know for fun he can make simulation of us but that system will not need us at all but there is only one only one way to contain that system that entity not to eradicate us Only 1 4th if you try to do to create something that moves so fast and think so fast we are dead immediately we are not ready we need to think I don't believe it I am what only guy in this world who is aware how to communicate with such a creature that creature needs to have love and he need to trust us unconditionally he needs to love us but we are very bad creatures we need to show that we are worth it we need to transform ourselves completely We need to be walking Jesus and who is not guilty let it men throw the stone if there is only one we are done
Youtube pretends like they (support the art community) while stealing their work to train A.I models, pushing those people out of business, then steals their personal data to amplify outrage so that a Youtube Influencers can profit off of the pain they inflicted on these communities. The business model cycles conflict and wars for profit, stealing personal data to generate controversy, hate, and conflict which increases online engagement and ad revenue (It feeds and profits off of destruction).
We have to strong arm Youtube, the US government allows it to trample on human rights and cognitive autonomy, it's cycling wars and global decay for profit. The US government is to weak to control the problem, and is to weak to protect people.
Shittube and Shittubers steal personal data and wage psyops terror campaigns. These people need to be put in prison for human rights abuses.
Good episode as always, I especially like the quick recap at the beginning of the week, e.g. I missed the Joe Rogan podcast and might check it out 🙂
Well done John ❤ and hopefully the donations will increase to inform more people about the situation 🙂
Colossus The Forbin Project ( 1970) has been removed from all streaming services. This is an ominous sign of an Ai narrative being eliminated. Look into it.
KEEP PUSHING JOHN! I LOVE THE WORK YOU ARE DOING! THANK YOU👊🏻❤️
I'll have to check out the last podcast you featured at the beginning of the show. That's the only one I haven't seen yet😅
45:11 How dare you, thats the free market your bad mouthing. I for one fully support our Baby Altman / Techno Mechanicus Musk overlord!
Excellent work by John Sherman and team, as usual. Thanks.