Elden Ring needs you to use a NOTEBOOK just to play it because it doens’t even keep a questlog?! OK, lets chat!
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Source https://twitter.com/jasonschreier/status/1496527074483392520
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I see someone making their own quest log and selling it. I remember a really nice one coming out for the original Zelda.
But yeah quest logs are normal now and not having one is an odd choice. But it's fine for me since I can just go online to see quest lines. I don't play souls games for a list of quests to complete.
Edit: yeah you're right. Quest logs are like accessibility options. If I have to Google the quest it's going to give me the answer. But quest log would let me go back to it to see the hint again.
I never understood these games, they felt like generic RPG's to me. Seems like the selling point is for people to feel like they accomplished something through difficulty.
It felt like you started the video a bit fed up already – but considering you spent time lurking in communities I can only imagine some of the frustration you probably had seeing some people's attitudes/comments!
A problem with having no in game notes would be for gamers who are busy with work or other commitments and so can only play a game like Elden Ring on weekends (with potentially even bigger gaps between sessions). A simple quest or chat log would greatly help refresh a player's memory on where they were and what they were doing. A physically written note can help this of course, but it does take extra time and is easier to misplace – I have notes written down somewhere for my Sunless Skies playthrough but buggered if I know where they are now.
Totally agree with you, although keeping a journal might make for a more immersive experience for some, i feel like gaming has evolved passed manually writing things down and interrupting the flow of gameplay. For my personal playstyle, I find constant interruptions make me less inclined to become immersed within the game. I like being completely absorbed in, and nothing breaking that.
If I have to resort to pausing the game, taking a note, then going back into the game, it'll just sour the experience. Similarly, just finding the right note when you're ready to do a certain quest would have the same impact.
I don't see why there couldn't just be an option to pick one or the other. A quest mode where it logs everything, and another mode for the "purists" where everything is turned off and its entirely up to you.
At the very least (as raised in the video), an option to add some notes to markers.
Just seems like the game is choosing to make the most mundane and simplistic convenience feature a pain in the ass for the sake of it.
Who wants to play that game anyway. 😆
I’m a old school gamer also I remember the notes in the booklets and the super hard games with no saves and I’m to dam old to go back to that hair pulling insanity. If you like that great enjoy the gray hairs. Lol
This brings up a valid point, can’t attest for bloodbourne or demons’ souls haven’t had played them, However previous souls games have never needed quest logs due to the fact the games have largely been linear. Elden ring being the first open world entry.
Most of the people defending not having a quest log/marker are people who make Youtube and Online Guides. Guess they're defending it for sake of channel views
Where's the Prima Guide?? LOL
I think a quest log with map markers is not needed for Elden Ring, but things like "this character found near this area wants this item" would be nice. Essentially make a notebook without needing to make a seperate notebook. Maybe even make it look like a notebook with sketches and whatnot.
Interesting opinion I disagree whole-heartedly. Botw also didn’t have quest markers. Some people like the mystery and true exploration. I don’t want From to start adopting Ubisoft style quest markers and objectives lists. I do like the letting players write their own in game notes. That’s a great compromise. Good video.
I still remember playing games like Myst / Riven (adventure puzzle games) where you could take books of notes trying to figure out those puzzles and the lore. This does come across trying to play skyrim / fallout without a quest log though, so i will hold my opinion until i play it.
yea I totally disagree, the game does give you a full host of map markers to mark locations, so if a player doesnt want to break "in game" immersion you can simply go back to lications and the npc act like a notepad to refresh your memory on the context. I personally love the idea of an empty in game map and a separate journal approach but a manual in game journal would be ok too. i hate all the open world games that LIST everything for you and give you a headache with hundreds of map markers and auto populated journal entries.
From what I've heard with review stuff, main quest and some bigger side quests are either marked on your map or in some why book-logged, It's optional stuff that isn't. Now I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice if even the small stuff was logged to make it easy to reference again, but I do understand the decision not to. Souls games have never spoon fed you anything other than the main objective, story especially. The devs enjoy mystery and discovery, for better or worse, so keeping an entire area behind some obscured quest line that gives you a key to open the door to it(or similar BS) is entirely on-brand. Am I saying this makes the games better? No, but it does add to the "Fromsoft Aesthetic" that fanboys have come to know and love, and I think the devs are trying to reach a middle ground between that. They may have over, or undershot depending who you ask, but either way I doubt the lack of a quest log will be the one thing that prevents people from enjoying the game as a whole.
I always have a notebook by my PC for such things as I play Warframe. Now, Warframe actually has a fully functioning quest log but the number of steps often involved in the games crafting processes means that I use the notbook to help me to stay focused on where I should be playing as it's such a huge beast of a game. I think that Genshin Impact gets the mapping balance right as it offers a selcetion of functional icons that you may place, label and remove as you work your way around the world map. If From Software really intened the lack of a quest log to be a 'feature' of the game, I don't really understand why Elden Ring couldn't have an option to tourn it on or off when you create your character as surely this would please all parties?
I think you can make an argument for Elden Ring not having quest logs etc as a deliberate design decision to enhance the mystery/exploration aspect that From Software seems to be leaning into. I do like the idea of making a special journal – rather than taking you out of the game that could actually draw you further into it.
I am not a fan of the high difficulty of From Software games. I've got nerve damage in my hands and – Sekiero especially – I find myself locked out of games I quite enjoy by my physical limitations. I've only finished one Souls game and I only managed that by some pretty extreme farming that detracted from the game experience and made it frankly boring.. Having an easy difficulty would make these games a better investment for me. As it stands I only buy them on deep discount, play them for a few weeks at best and give up. There's far more to these games than their difficulty – I'd argue that the opening cinematic and witches sequence (basically the first 15 minutes of the game) for Dark Souls 2 is one of the best pieces of world building out there. To lose the rest of the experience because of punishing difficulty….that's not good game design. That's just sad. All that effort by so many talented people, hidden away. It seems like a terrible waste to me.
choosing to ignore something in the game and actually not having it in the game is not the same thing.
You speak of a lack of quest logs as a "lagging behind" on the part of FromSoft when I believe it's a conscious choice by the developers to not include such things. Take Morrowind for example. In that game you have access to a quest log that gives you directions to your next objectives instead of giving you a map marker. This gives the player the opportunity to engage with the environment instead of just beelining to a marker. I don't think the Ubisoft approach to games should be the gold standard.
Do you know that souls games have no : Pause Game Feature. Yes! you heard me : you cannot pause the game!
Put a quest log, a pause game and why not also have a difficulty slider!!
The game is made this way, to keep you immersed. It only has minimum menues. I`ve them talk about this in an early interview.
You will not need a notebook and there are markers in the game. This is hyperbole and if you need help finding something you can simply look on the internet if you wish to be guided.
aa yes i love wondering for 3 hours aimlessly not know what or where to go then just uninstall and refund the the game because i actually have a life and i cant afford wasting it in boring shit
Floating quest logs and reminders break immersion, I feel like Elden Ring is real medieval adventure where you have to remember areas NPC's said to visit or that you have to do something and if you forgot that's operator error and I love that feels more real.
My opinion always is: I'll see how it runs and plays when I play it running on my own PC.
I have the ability to think for myself and form my own opinions.
Yeah… how many big world games need a on line map to help players.. e.g Atlas or Scum.
Disagree. I hate quest log check lists. This feels more organic, like I'm exploring, and not doing my daily quota of fetches.
Just a subtle differnece between the game managing your quest list and th euser writing it down. It is not a huge diference, and I am not advocating for it, just food for thought. Game design itself can be affected by this, even deliberately. Imagine this scenereo. A game's design knows there is no quest log, no arrow above people head, nor where to go exactly. It couod be designed in such a way the quests are easier, or finding a certain quest spot in a certain area could be easier to see or find once u tget to the right area. It oculd be more rewarding having "discovered it": your self with less clues. but when a game's design knows there are ful logs and arrows and such, they can just sen du all over the plac,de talk to 20 people in 20 locations, just to consume time. BUt quests could be more vague, but less objectives, longer to find per objective, and once u r inthe right area it stands out pretty good. Overall I prefer quest logs still,, but an argument could be made if and only if the game design is made with this in mind. Not just to take a standard game design and REMOVE the logs.
The reviews seem like another big echo-chamber…
I feel like maybe if they want to encourage non-linear exploration, they could have a quest log which tells you the quests and where you found them but no quest markets to tell you exactly how to complete them
Prefer no quest markers or notebooks because it sparks community discussions
I think uncharted is a great example of doing this. Whenever you have a puzzle, Nathan will write down important things in his journal as well as just extra drawings and notes etc… You don't have to write things down yourself or run back and forth which streamlines the gameplay.
It still means the player has to solve it and it's immersive within the world, it just cuts out the player writing it down.
Quest logs take you out the game in the same way. I don't to play the game, and being stuck navigating through menus to find what I need does not help with immersion. Games have also become a sort of checklist of sorts, and each one ends up feeling similar to the last because as opposed to exploring, I feel like I have a job within the game itself. There can be a happy middle here I think. You saying that feeling an obligation to do quests when they are all listed is a player issue is just wrong. That's like saying UX doesn't exist. Everyone is different, and games should adapt to different play styles, not all be the same.
I think FS should add map markers and quest logs and difficulty selection, then have them off by default and if they are turned on give people an achievement conversely if cleared without award a different achievement. It would just be a very big troll move kn their part that id get a kick out of.
I still have my log book and 3 ring binder full of player created maps from my time playing Everquest. I used to get lost over and over just wandering around Freeport, until I memorized the city setup.
Lol, making your own journal would be awfull for left handed people like me, my hand is always covered in pen from my hand going over the stuff i had just written down.
No need for quest markers in souls game it would ruin the mystery imo plus what’s wrong with using a little note pad for jotting down reminders and tips? I like doing this it reminds me of the wonder I felt playing games as a kid before you had smartphones to search up any problem you come across.
I have recently started playing Dark Souls Remastered, filthy casual incoming here, I have made a list of enemies i need to beat and have a specific build i am adhering to but i am playing for something much more here, MY PRIDE. I tried playing that game a long time ago in the original version and i failed to beat the Asylum demon and the Taurus Demon at the beginning of which i then swore i would never paly the game again as i could not do it. Move onto about a month ago and i beat them both in two attempts each. The Gargoyle took a bit longer to beat but i beat it after multiple attempts within 4 hours that is as i streamed the thing. I have all the Souls games and Elden Ring and i plan to beat them all in sequence, also God of War aswell. That is my take on the games currently, i do not know what i am doing but i will figure it out and when i do it will my saving grace, my salvation.
I perfectly fine with the game not having a internal log book but then again they could of created a visual one instead of a menu.
If I’m not mistaken the Uncharted series uses a journal pretty well.
Fallout menus are part of the game through the Pip-Boy.
Green Hell and The Forest both use journals.
I love videos like these where you elaborate your points/discussion in detail.
Its not like these games havent evolved alongside other games and taken idears from them but stripping some excess away making some thing cleaner and trusting in the player. For excample the quest logs and stuff. As long as you pay attention youre going to be allright and there wont be all that repetative open world noncence. Even a "simple" guest becomes a bit more interesting as long as youre not just wondering towards a dot on a map. That doesnt necesserally mean its lacking in features.