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time stamps
0:00 Intro
3:38 The First Necrons
8:41 The Spookycrons, 3rd edition
16:14 The problem with the original Lore
21:18 The New Crons, The Necron Lore Overhaul. 5th Edition
37:44 Are Necrons Less Grimdark Now?
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Much of the early 40k races and lore was basically turning warhammer fantasy into a sci-fi game. Knights became space marines, Elves became eldar, orks… got guns?… Orks didn't change much… The 3rd edition necrons are space skeletons/undead and their backstory reinforced that with ranks of mindless skeletons as the core of the army.
Of course their 3rd edition rules were basically we are space marines but better at almost everything and regenerate. I am happy this changed. I played against the necrons a few times in 3rd edition and completely wiped the table with them until the monoliths were all that was left and then those single handedly destroyed my entire army as my las cannons pinged off them like rain drops. They are much more interesting to fight now and when I started playing 40k again with 9th edition, I ended up with a necron indomitius half and now have 5k+ points of necrons.
Some 3rd edition necrons still had personality and self awareness. That is part of what made lords, lords; their strength of will allowed them to retain parts of their personalities after the biotransferance. Also, the biotransferance was in 3rd edition lore, but didn't have a name yet. It is not like the c'tan magically turned the necrotyr into the necrons, the c'tan taught the necrotyr the technology to do so, but then betrayed the necrotyr by devouring their souls during the process. The lords had personality and not all of them followed or were controlled by the c'tan, it just wasn't explored very well because they were so new.
The current necrons are much more characterful, but it is more because they have been detailed and developed over the 20+ years they have been around. The 3rd edition backstory didn't indicate there couldn't be named characters, it just hadn't introduced them yet. The groundwork was there though.
They perfectly depict the way ANYONE is getting 40k lore. Based on imperial speculation, we simply found out more than them being all silently marching.. I remember the older lore, they were more scary, but didn't get worse later on. Just the 40k media doesn't show how powerful they (still) are.
It's pretty cool that you can read the cain books now after this apparently massive retcon, and the necrons in those books fit in perfectly with the new lore.
I'm just PISSED that they got rid of the Pariahs, they were the only anti psyker units they had. I loved them.
Hey wess how does one go about requesting a lote topic? I love 40k but specifically its through you ive tried looking things up but ima be real as a dad that works wasaaaaaaaaay to much and then sepnds his "free" time with the kids i personally dont have time to research.
Im wanting to know if youd do a video on the eldar gods. Something about them fasinates me when they are mentioned but also confuses me to the core.
Long story short: Oldcrons were tyranids.
will you talk about the new fulgrim model…he is had the last crone sword please help us understand
I think all 3 variations on the lore are correct from given viewpoints.
The oldest is the perspective of the Imperium and their presumptions.
The 3rd ed is the perspective of the C'Tan, if they were interested in telling you. Even in their fragmented state, their ego probably sees the Necron as mindless, and themselves as mighty – which is why we saw "intact free gods" back then.
The current lore is the perspective of the Necrons themselves. Only they would know this much about themselves.
I been going thru ur Playlist. And I haven't seen u do faction deep dive for salamanders… or did I miss it in one of the bigger compilations in another vid I haven't seen. Love ur breakdowns BTW. Very awesome and watch Grimm dark stories wth my sister. Fascinates and creeps her out. Always look forward to new one.
Necron chuds see their favorite faction get fleshed out, making them even more tragic and grimdark, and they're really like "Ruined"
I quite like the new lore for the war in heaven. However, I think most of the characters despite being interesting ruin the vibe of the OG necrons, also being overly negative to what alot of people hold dear isn't very respectful. If you had made a less biased video I would have alot easier of a time to relate to why you think the new necrons are better. But not going 5min without saying old necrons bad gets repetetive and annoying.
I always felt that the new necrons ended up being petty, silly and ended up seeming a bit sad. They basically ended up like eldar, but without any real self reflection. They came across as a race of failures whose great deeds no longer really meant anything – but where the eldar struggled to get back up (or keep what they had in the case of dark eldar), the Necrons just seemed to be doing….not that much.
I can root for the all the other factions, but the Necrons just seem to be a story that has been told. Maybe if they went down the route of Vampire Counts rather than tomb kings i could get behind that.
The new Necron lore does not exist in my headcanon. It’s best not to let GW mess with the things you like. Just take the bits that you like and ignore the stupid stuff.
The Dolman Gates are a stupid retcon. In Battlefleet Gothic Armada supplement it was explained that Necrons used actual FTL like warp drive and that really spoke to their advanced nature that they didn’t need to rely on the warp for FTL in any guise. But the dolman gate reduced them to parasites of the old ones creations.
This is the kind of retcon that I ignore.
I see both as correct.
The older lore represents the first probing strikes, the imperium known very little and assume they are just robots, like servitors.
As more time passes more information is learnt about them and the deeper newer lore appears.
Well they’ve certainly made the custodes less grim dark. The community largely rejects the femstodes but they don’t seem to care.
I like to view 3rd edition as more what the Imperium knew, or thought they knew about the Necron. They believed the C'tan were in charge, because of their power. They believed the Necron were mindless robots, because that is what the lower cast soldiers basically were. And what happened in the "War in Heaven" was just the parts the Imperium learned and the rest was just hypothesized by the Imperium's scribes.
While 5th Edition is finally the truth of who the Necrons are, and what really happened 60 million years ago.
Betraying, enslaving, and shattering a GOD into millions of pieces to use as weapons and power sources sounds pretty grim dark to me.
That wagh! Mr bond for some reason just got me.
its all grimdark – I think people are assuming the lore TOO literally…
each lore dump is from one level of depth or perspective.
the final version is what likely factually happened while the previous versions were more speculation from the necron populace.
there is a saying, don't get to know your heroes – and in this case it applies and removes the veil.
necrons are still just as scary just because the veil has been lifted and the generalization has been cleared – its basically the same
I always felt that old James Workshop though they didn't need two entirely personality-less unbeatable factions.
I miss Pariahs 😭
This is the era where I came up with the joke that the Imperial Palace was actually one giant titan that could be called on in the end times and it actually did have a model somewhere in GW's vaults. It was three feet tall and a friend of mine said the Point Cost was Yes.
Such an annoying voice, can't listen to more than 10 seconds…
I never saw it as retcon so much as the first ones waking up really didn't have a direction yet, so that's what it looked like. Since then the more "in control" have woken up, which explains the change for me enough to let BOTH exist in the same story…. just maybe give them a few years/decades between starting to wake up and what we know now.
So…. the desire to explain a mysterious race in a fiction sterilizes the charm for short term appeal. What makes stories evocative, is letting notable things go unexplained.
This is a geek/nerd phenomenon I suppose – to bring a strong compulsion to solve for xyz., and is why franchises should consider catering less to them.
I think using visuals more than words when it comes to 'explaining' things is what people want, even though they nearly demand answers.
Don't know if anyone said something already, but Necron Pariahs DO show up in one more piece of lore, though canonicity is now debated. That's the Dawn of War: Dark Crusade and Soulstorm Videogames. Dark Crusade, in fact, has a Necron Pariah that speaks for the army. Pretty interesting if you don't mind old RTS.
I see why they did it – it is a miniature game and armies with no personality to speak off do not quite fit the hobby… And the old Necrons were absolutely a one-trick pony army – a bunch of mostly mindless killing-machines BUT without the bio-adaptability and variety the Tyranids offer.
But in the end what we have is essentially Tomb Kings in space. Yeah… they got personalities, some of the fun and interesting characters… But they lost a lot of the dread they invoked.
Gone is the silent techno-undead army marching in perfect unison with a singular purpose. The zombie-terminators hellbent on annihilation of all life.
Gone is the threat so terrifying that even Tyranids do their best to actively avoid them for purposes other than simple lack of biomass to consume.
Gone is the thing so terrifying it makes the Eldar shiver… And let me remind you that they already have a soul-eating Slaanesh to worry about.
And you literally could not kill them off. All their dead would teleport back and be repaired. Or they would stand right back up right on the battlefield. It gave you the feeling of a never-ending war of attrition against a faction that feels no fear and always comes back, wave after wave.
Even if you forced their retreat, you had this feeling that they effectively took no losses, while your own army was bloodied and battered – in narrative sense, it was terrifying and cool.
You might argue that Tyranids fill the similar niche… And it is true, but they lack same sense of dread. The main Tyranid force is mostly just an animalistic horde, unless they engage into some Alien and Invasion of the Body Snatchers style shenanigans with Genestealer Cults.
Tyranids also have this shtick of having multiple Tendrils – even if armies themselves have no "personality" in a traditional sense, you can always personalise them due to species own adaptive properties. Something Necrons were not intended to have.
I prefer old Necrons, they were brutal and lack any human traits. NuCrons are just generic Egyptians in space. Lame as fuck.
Necrons are my number one race, and i semi-liked their old lore, i semi-like like their new lore. I think it could have been done better.
Honestly i started off with disliking the necrons retcon due to my starting point being Dawn of War. Then i realized having characters such as Trazyn and Imotekh is a far better boon for Necrons and the dynamic in the universe. In a sense the Necrons are like humanity that has fallen even deeper, a dark mirror that differ from other antagonist in the universe. Tyranids are animalistic, Chaos want to go on a different path from current humanity, Orks want to have fun killing, Tau is the new innocent kid on the block and Necrons are the one that wish to reclaim their lost "humanity". It just makes more sense than them overlapping with Orks and Tyranids but just being mechanical.
I jumped into WH40K, even if not totally as I have no actual tabletop models, & therefore no tabletop experience, via the 'Dawn of War' games.
At first they seemed like a giant plain, but implacable, undeniable, indefatigable species of destruction for which there may never be a solution. I was actually a little bummed to hear about the revamp, & the introduction of personalities, & will. But it eventually began to make a lot of sense. They did very well in patching up their back story which make the 'Nucrons' story cohesive & fit into the universe. I therefore kinda dig what they are now. I need more though. More videos & I'm considering getting the two codex in question here. I need to see how all the 'Nucrons' behave, see where the undying doom they were once perceived as, now lies.
Good stuff & great video. This was sweet.
I own that old book, and I've forgotten much about it, but that being said, I personally loved the change; I'm often an outlier in these kinds of opinions. However, I did like the spooky and mysterious design, but at the same time I do like the fleshed out design.
The Oldcrons were brilliant for the Lore. The glooming Doom.
The Newcrons are good for Shareholders. More marketable.
GW doesnt need more money. It needs better Lore.
There is a tipping point in grimdark, where if you're too grimdark it just starts to come across as a joke.
Many people dig Necrons because they hate assembling and painting models and the Necrons are the easiest to assemble and can be painted to the standard store game/tournament three paint minimum by anyone of any skill really easily to tabletop passable. Black primer, your preferred gunmetal grey, black wash and a splash of you favorite bright green on a gun and you're ready to play. Games Workshop has always seriously underestimated the number of people they would get into their game and sell shit to if in addition to the model kits they also sold premium priced pre-built and pre-painted armies. Maybe they're hobbled in their thought due to being British?